Thomas Ivall (1837-1908), baker in Chalvey

Thomas Ivall was the eldest son of Robert Thomas Ivall (1812-65), who was the only brother of David Ivall (1816-67), my great great great grandfather. This profile contains information from research done by Dennis Endean Ivall.

Thomas was born on 6 August 1837 in High Wycombe and baptized in All Saints Church, High Wycombe on 3 September 1837. He was the eldest of eight children (4 boys and 4 girls) born to Robert Thomas Ivall and his wife Harriet nee Owen. Robert had a coach making business (which failed) and lived in High Wycombe until about 1849.

In October 1848, Thomas, then aged 11, was apprenticed to H Hunt for a term of 5 years to learn the trade of needle and fishing tackle maker. Robert, Thomas’s father, paid a premium of five pounds to Mr Hunt, who agreed to provide Thomas with necessary food, clothing, lodging and washing. Thomas moved to Redditch in Worcestershire for the apprenticeship.

The 1851 census shows Thomas (aged 13, an apprentice fishing tackle maker) living at Hill Street, Redditch at the house of Henry Hunt (33, a fishing tackle maker) with his wife Hannah (45), daughter Elizabeth (13) and another apprentice William Knight (15).

In 1861, Thomas, aged 23, was working as a baker at Hillingdon House, Middlesex. He was one of about 30 servants in the household headed by Richard Henry Cox, aged 81, an army agent.

By 1864, Thomas was working at Bretby Hall, Burton on Trent, the country seat of the Earl of Chesterfield. I have a copy of a letter written by a solicitor to Thomas at Bretby Hall, regarding the estate of his grandfather Thomas Ivall (1781-1835). The residue of the estate (£1800) had been invested to provide an income for his widow Jane, with instructions to divide it between his three children (or their offspring if dead) on her death. Jane died in 1866. Robert (Thomas’s father) had died in 1865. The letter says “in my opinion you are entitled to a share of his share notwithstanding that your father received and spent his share in his lifetime.” Thomas’s share was about £60 (about £2,700 in modern day terms). In 1866 he successfully brought a case against David Ivall (his uncle) at the Court of Chancery to get this share.

Thomas’s father was the Bucks and Middlesex District Secretary of the Ancient Order of Foresters. This was a Friendly Society whose members paid a few pence a week into a common fund from which sick pay and funeral grants could be drawn. The members of local branches (known as courts) also met and socialised. The newspaper extract below describes a dinner held in 1864 by the Slough branch. Thomas chaired the occasion and proposed various toasts.

From Windsor and Eton Express 23 July 1864

Thomas later became a trustee of the local branch of the Ancient Order of Foresters.

In 1867, Thomas married Lucy Hobden (born 1845 in Ashburnham, Sussex) in St George’s Church, Hanover Square, London. He was 30 and she 22. Thomas had met Lucy in London, where she was on the staff of Lord Ashburnham at his London residence (she was normally at Ashburnham House in Sussex). Lucy is distantly related to the Australian cricketer Sir Donald Bradman (1908-2001) via her mother Mary Furner (1816-1878).

Marriage record of Thomas Ivall

Clara Hobden Ivall was born during April 1867 in the registration district of Battle in Sussex and died aged 17 weeks in August that year. She was buried in St James, Ashburnham on 16 Aug 1867. She was a child of Thomas and Lucy Ivall, who married on 2 March 1867. It was not unusual at this time for women to be pregnant when they married. Thomas and Lucy went on to have 15 other children namely Walter George (1868-1953), Robert Thomas (1870-1), Ellen Maud (1872-81), Annie Lucy (1874-1949), Harry Alfred (1975-1901), Catherine Dora (1877-1963), Percy Bertram (1879-1971), Reginald John (1881-1966), Charles Oliver (1883-1954), Margaret Olive (1883-1976), Gilbert Edward (1884-1914), Jane Evelyn (1886-1971), Geoffrey Ernest (1888-88), David Philip Stanhope (1890-1950) and Gerald (1892-1983). The children were born in Chalvey, a village which is now a district of Slough in Buckinghamshire. Twelve of the children survived into adulthood. Lucy was aged 47 when her final child was born. Confusingly, many of the children were known by other names. For instance, Charles Oliver was known as Joseph !

Thomas ran a bakery in Chalvey. The 1871 census shows Thomas Ivall (aged 33, a master baker), his wife Lucy (24) and their children Walter George (2) and Robert Thomas (7 months) living at 6 Jordan Place, Upton Cum Chalvey. Jordan Place (which no longer exists) was a terrace of houses on Church Street, Chalvey about 150 yards NW of St Peter’s Church.

By 1881 Thomas Ivall aged 44, a master baker, was living at Jordan Place Baker’s Shop, Upton Cum Chalvey with his wife Lucy (34) and their children Walter George (12), Annie Lucy (7), Harry Alfred (5), Catherine Dora (3), Percy Bertram (1) and Reginald (2 months). Also living there was Eliza Hobden (27, a nurse), Lucy’s sister.

The 1883 and 1899 editions of Kelly’s Directory of Buckinghamshire have entries for Thomas Ivall, Baker, Church St, Chalvey. The Bucks Herald reported in 1886 that Thomas was one of four parish constables appointed for Chalvey. 

Thomas Ivall of Church St, Chalvey is listed in the 1890 Electoral Register for the Slough Parliamentary Polling District of the Southern or Wycombe Division of Buckinghamshire. The 1884 Reform Act extended the vote for those who lived outside urban boroughs. Men over the age of 21 who held property worth £10 a year or who paid £10 a year in rent were given the vote. It is thought that this extended the electorate from about 40% to about 60% of the adult male population.

The Slough, Eton and Windsor Observer records that Thomas was the foreman of the jury at local inquests in January and March 1890, both into the death of children.

In 1891, the family consisted of Thomas (53, a baker), Lucy (43), Walter (22, an assistant schoolmaster), Annie (17), Harry (15, a baker), Catherine (13), Percy (11), Reginald (10), Charles (8), Margaret (8), Gilbert (6), Jane (4) and David (0.75). Their address was 6 Jordan Place, Church St, Chalvey.

Thomas’s son, Harry Alfred Ivall joined the London police in 1899 and was based in Southwark. He died of blood poisoning at St Thomas’ Hospital, Lambeth in 1901, aged 25 and was buried in St Mary’s churchyard, Slough.

By 1901, Thomas, aged 63, a retired baker was living at 39 The Crescent, Chalvey, Slough. Also in the household were his wife Lucy (52) and their children (Catherine) Dora (23, a milliner), Charles (18, a baker), Margaret (18), Gilbert (15), Jane (14), David (10) and Gerald (8). The house is still there. Electoral registers for 1904 to 1907 show Thomas's address as 23 Chalvey Road, Slough.

St Mary's Church, Chalvey

Thomas died 11 March 1908 in Chalvey aged 71. He was buried in St Mary’s churchyard, Slough on 16 March 1908 in the same plot (row 18, sections A/D) as his son Harry. The parish burial record gives Thomas’s address as 37 Chalvey Rd. His wife Lucy lived until 1929 when she died aged 84. She was buried in the same grave. St Mary’s churchyard was tidied up in 1980 when many gravestones were removed. I have not been able to find the Ivall gravestone. Slough Local Studies Collection has a list of the monumental inscriptions for the graves (including the Ivall plot) that were in the churchyard.

Owen Ivall (b 1846), whitesmith

Owen Ivall was a son of Robert Thomas Ivall (1812-65), who was the only brother of David Ivall (1816-67), my great great great grandfather.

Owen was born on 17 March 1846 in High Wycombe and baptized in All Saints Church, High Wycombe on 26 April 1846. He was the sixth of eight children (4 boys and 4 girls) born to Robert Thomas Ivall and his wife Harriet nee Owen. Robert had a coach making business (which failed) and lived in High Wycombe until about 1849. In 1850 his youngest child (Harriett) was baptized in Burnham, a village between Maidenhead and Slough. In 1851 he was living in Chalvey, a village which is now a district of Slough. The census that year shows Robert (aged 38, his occupation given as coach maker) with Harriet his wife (46) and their children Robert (10), Jane (9), Marian (6), Owen (5), Louisa (3) and Harriet (7 months).

The family was still living in Chalvey in 1861. The census lists Robert aged 48, a coach maker woodman with Harriet (56), Owen (15), Louisa (13), and Harriet (10). Also at the same address was Jane Ivall (80), Robert’s widowed mother who died in 1866.

Owen’s father Robert died in 1865 when Owen was aged 19. He received a share (£40 10s 8d, equivalent to about £1,850 now) of his grandfather’s estate in 1867 when he reached the age of 21.

On 11 October 1868, Owen married Maria Emily Moss (the daughter of a farmer) at Holy Trinity Church, Windsor. They were both aged 22. His occupation is given as “whitesmith” – the dictionary definition is (1) worker in tin (2) polisher or finisher of metal goods. The witnesses were John Bampton (the husband of Owen’s sister Jane) and Harriet Ivall (Owen’s sister). Maria was pregnant at the time of her marriage.

Owen and Maria had six children (3 boys and 3 girls) namely Maria Emily (b 1869), Harriet Jane (b 1870), Eliza Ada (b1872), Owen Francis (b1874), Robert Thomas Owen (b1876) and Archibald Owen (b1883). All were born in Chalvey.

The 1871 census shows Owen living with his widowed mother at 1 Sussex Place, Chalvey. The household consisted of Harriett Ivall (66), Owen (25), Maria (24), Emily (2), Harriet (7 months) and Owen’s brother Robert (30).

I have a copy of handwritten pages recording the dates of birth of the children of Robert Thomas Ivall, probably from a family bible. They state that Owen Francis Ivall, eldest son of Owen Ivall was “Killed on the Spot” on 21 July 1879 aged 4 years 11 months. The Bucks Herald (26 July 1879) published an item describing an inquest on the boy.

Harriet Jane Ivall, another of Owen’s children, died aged 10 in January 1881. At the time of the 1881 census, Owen (aged 35, a whitesmith) and his wife Maria (34) were living at 2 Sussex Place, Chalvey with their children Maria Emily (12), Eliza Ada (8) and Robert Thomas (4). Tragedy struck again in March 1883 when Owen’s wife died 18 days after the birth of their child Archibald.

The Slough, Eton and Windsor Observer (viewable on the website Slough History Online) has several references to Owen :

- In December 1883 and June 1885 the orders for the No 5 (Slough) Company, First Bucks Rifle Volunteers show Corporal O Ivall on duty. In September 1884 he is recorded as having taken part in a shooting competition (Owen came 22^nd out of 28).

- In October 1884 Owen was summoned by order of the School Attendance Committee of the Eton Union for not sending his children regularly to school and fined 2s. He was summoned again for the same offence in July 1885 and fined 2s 6d (equivalent to about £6 now).

Owen married Sarah Smith nee Plumridge in June 1885 at St John the Evangelist, Eton. His new wife was a widow, the daughter of a shoemaker and aged 39, as was Owen.

In December 1886, Owen appeared at Bucks Petty Sessions for public drunkenness. The newspaper report says :

“Owen Ivall, whitesmith, of Chalvey was summoned by the police for having been drunk and incapable on the public streets. Defendant said he “kicked against the pavement.” Police Constable Lillywhite said that at 11 o’clock of the 23^rd instant he found the defendant lying in the gutter in the High Street, Slough, helplessly drunk. Witness got assistance and defendant was taken to Police station. In answer to defendant witness said “You did not walk to the station but we had to carry you there. You could not stand at the station and fell down.” Mr Superintendent Dunham said defendant was brought to the station was drunk and helpless as a child. The Magistrates inflicted a fine of 7s 6d including costs or 7 days imprisonment in default of payment. The money was paid.”

Owen’s second marriage was not happy, as shown by a report in the Slough, Eton and Windsor Observer of 10 Sep 1887 under the heading Bucks Petty Sessions

“MATRIMONIAL BLISS – Owen Ivall, whitesmith, of Slough, was charged with having assaulted his wife, Sarah Ivall, and threatened to murder her, on the 31^st August. It appeared that the defendant is the third husband of the complainant, and that he was a widower when he married her. They have been living at No. 2, Stoke Gardens. Their life for the past year or so has been a very uncomfortable one, constant quarrels taking place between them, and the woman (according to the evidence of a neighbour named Charles Maslin) often getting beastly drunk. On Tuesday, the 31^st August last, the defendant, so complainant now stated, came home about six o’clock in the evening and asked for his tea. Mrs Ivall said to him “You must find the money to get tea.” Defendant then put down his basket, took out his hammer, caught hold of her by the chest and raising the hammer up towards her head said “I will murder you, you -----, or I you shall murder me.” He also told her to go out of the house, as she was his wife no more. He had caught hold of her arm and her arm was covered with bruises in consequence of his violence. He had assaulted her the day before and he was in the habit of thumping her and spitting in her face. She said she went in fear of her life from him. Defendant now denied the assault and the threats. He said what did occur had been through his having caught her with another man in William Street on the preceding Monday evening and she had stayed out till 12 o’clock at night. Mrs Ivall said the man referred to had wished her good evening as she was going along the street and she had simply wished him good evening in return. There had been no impropriety whatever between them. She was merely going to the coffee house to get a cup of tea, as she felt very sinking, having been much upset by her husband abusing her. Charles Maslin, who is employed on the Great Western Railway, gave evidence as to the quarrels between complainant and her husband and said that he had seen her throw bricks and flower-pots at her husband. He believed what occurred was entirely owing to complainant’s bad conduct. The Chairman said it was no doubt a very uncomfortable state of things for a household to be living in the state described as existing between defendant and his wife. It appeared that the defendant had received considerable provocation from his wife’s conduct, and as the Bench did not consider the charge had been proved, he would be discharged. Mrs Ivall incidentally mentioned that she is now living with her father in Thames Court, Eton.”

In October 1891, Owen's son Robert began an apprenticeship to learn to be a sailor on the training ship Arethusa. The paperwork for this says that Owen deserted his children in June 1891. I can find no further records of Owen’s life. I cannot locate him or his sons Robert and Archibald in the England and Wales April 1891 census, nor does Owen appear in the 1901 or 1911 census.  His death doesn’t seem to have been registered in England. It may be that he went abroad ? Owen’s daughter Emily married in 1897 and the parish record of the marriage states Owen Ivall as her father, without saying that he was deceased (unlike her spouse’s father who is listed as deceased). So it appears that she thought that he was (or could be) still alive then.